I often receive messages from people both inside and outside of The Satanic Temple who claim to find avenues for further involvement within our organization impenetrable and unwelcoming.
Well said. Some of this is on congregation heads who don’t understand how to screen people for membership status. They don’t know how to profile the types of people attracted to TST, people who want to collaborate, and work toward common goals, and people looking for power. A congregant mentioned the work of Bob Altemeyer. This may be valuable moving forward. So many cry authoritarianism yet, really, it’s just basic structure, nothing more. Finally, those who hold the opinion that TST is fully corrupt, if that’s the case for you, don’t stay. No one should stay with a group they hold in such low regard.
The ministry often exercises thoughts, abuse and idea to members or alleys that they have noooo business exercising. It's shameful and I have no idea why they are allowed to stay. Have a "Satan TST fan club" for those members who want connection but lack the brains. 50 great minds can do the work of the 50,000 entitled brats that have no interest in actually serving the cause which is effecting soooo many Americans.
what I find even more bizarre is the aggrieved entitlement of people who aren't even paying any kind of tithes and are not even being active encouraged to fundraise for campaigns. Like all this stuff protecting us all from theocracy costs money. Lawfare isn't cheap. It's beyond strange to me the people who can't even donate a small amount monthly (as MOST members of MOST Christian churches do) to support their own rights. I don't donate to TST as some form of "altruism", I donate because I don't want to live in a theocracy. It comes ENTIRELY from my own self interest. I don't care about any of this behind the scenes drama. All I care about is that the campaigns and law fare continue and the fight goes on. And I understand that costs money.
Exactly! And these entitled actors are actively working against the organization they desperately want to be a part of and yet they can't see it because of their ego. Their lack of education and intelligence is already an embarrassment but it's something I would be willing to work with if they weren't so mean and vicious.
I suspect a lot of them came out of CoS, a group that attracts a lot of malignant narcissists. I've witnessed a lot of childish nastiness from that group. I wouldn't even be surprised if they weren't actively sent in as 'double agents'. The level of hate for TST from CoS suggests that even if a little "paranoid" , that paranoia isn't that unwarranted.
And while I'm sure there are plenty of CoS members who are lovely people, the actual writings of Anton LaVey are the ramblings of a malignant narcissist, and under the current leadership that narcissism has only flowered. LaVey was deeply misogynistic and authoritarian and thought Satanists were elite people who should rule over all the ignorant dirty masses. Also he was a pretty big dork for someone who thought h was so super superior. Basically he just wanted a secret society but wasn't "elite enough" to get into Skull and Bones. He also mainly used it as a cover to get laid. Given his entire persona, it's not a mystery to me why he would have otherwise been a basement incel.
Just like there are plenty of nice Christians who haven't read the Bible deeply enough to understand what an evil tyrant biblegod is, I would assume most of the good CoS people haven't actually read or fully understood everything Lavey said and wrote. it's hard to imagine someone having read all of it and not understanding all the elitism, narcissism, and authoritarianism therein.
Given that, it would be foolish to assume the organization doesn't attract a lot of people who DO understand those facets of CoS and are fully on board with them. Being told you're a superior being just for being a member of CoS obviously is going to appeal to malignant narcissists and it shouldn't be shocking that people like that would be drawn to the organization.
that's clearly not a universal thing, though. The main CoS has a rabid hate on for TST. I'm not sweeping everybody into one pot. I'm saying there are a lot of CoS ppl who rabidly hate TST and their official twitter account seems incapable of not randomly arguing and attacking anyone who says anything nice about TST. They clearly have a bug up their ass. I'm not saying "everybody's bad". I'm saying there are bad actors in every organization and given the known weird one-sided rivalry (I don't ever see TST people attacking or even really thinking about CoS for the most part), I would at least consider the possibility that not everybody coming from there to TST has the purest motives.
I don't know or care to dive deeper into any more drama. The CoS members who I consider friends know my beliefs and how much I believe in TST and Mr Greaves and they respect that completely. I now look at LaVey as kind of a genius Satanic Grandpa who had colorful ideas but also happened to be a dirty old man who was a bit too silly for my taste. I do have to admit, LaVey has grown on me slightly.
The creative process requires chaos before form emerges ~ Marilyn Ferguson
…Perhaps this is where some type of form emerges.
We’re just glad you aren’t apologizing for being you! I think all those haters are just pissed their own expectations weren’t met. That’s what happens when you set expectations, though.
The very traits so many seem to think of as "character flaws" (the strident standing for one thing and not bending or breaking no matter how many people complain) is what makes me trust someone as a leader because I know where they stand, what they plan to do, and that nobody can worm their way into the organization and manipulate them onto a different unrelated path.
Well said. Some of this is on congregation heads who don’t understand how to screen people for membership status. They don’t know how to profile the types of people attracted to TST, people who want to collaborate, and work toward common goals, and people looking for power. A congregant mentioned the work of Bob Altemeyer. This may be valuable moving forward. So many cry authoritarianism yet, really, it’s just basic structure, nothing more. Finally, those who hold the opinion that TST is fully corrupt, if that’s the case for you, don’t stay. No one should stay with a group they hold in such low regard.
Exactly! Once the the thread spools too far and you have idiots making ridiculous decisions then the quality control is gone and everything is lost.
The ministry often exercises thoughts, abuse and idea to members or alleys that they have noooo business exercising. It's shameful and I have no idea why they are allowed to stay. Have a "Satan TST fan club" for those members who want connection but lack the brains. 50 great minds can do the work of the 50,000 entitled brats that have no interest in actually serving the cause which is effecting soooo many Americans.
It's hard to believe that with all that's going on, this is the disgraceful crap I see from some of our own people.
I'm so sorry Mr. Greaves. I will continue to hail you, your work and the members I love. Thank you for being a rock.
Oh my bad. 50,000 member that can't do work. They are so mired in ego it's impossible.
what I find even more bizarre is the aggrieved entitlement of people who aren't even paying any kind of tithes and are not even being active encouraged to fundraise for campaigns. Like all this stuff protecting us all from theocracy costs money. Lawfare isn't cheap. It's beyond strange to me the people who can't even donate a small amount monthly (as MOST members of MOST Christian churches do) to support their own rights. I don't donate to TST as some form of "altruism", I donate because I don't want to live in a theocracy. It comes ENTIRELY from my own self interest. I don't care about any of this behind the scenes drama. All I care about is that the campaigns and law fare continue and the fight goes on. And I understand that costs money.
Exactly! And these entitled actors are actively working against the organization they desperately want to be a part of and yet they can't see it because of their ego. Their lack of education and intelligence is already an embarrassment but it's something I would be willing to work with if they weren't so mean and vicious.
I suspect a lot of them came out of CoS, a group that attracts a lot of malignant narcissists. I've witnessed a lot of childish nastiness from that group. I wouldn't even be surprised if they weren't actively sent in as 'double agents'. The level of hate for TST from CoS suggests that even if a little "paranoid" , that paranoia isn't that unwarranted.
I've never had a problem with CoS members. The few that I have dealt with have treated me with respect and I consider them friends.
And while I'm sure there are plenty of CoS members who are lovely people, the actual writings of Anton LaVey are the ramblings of a malignant narcissist, and under the current leadership that narcissism has only flowered. LaVey was deeply misogynistic and authoritarian and thought Satanists were elite people who should rule over all the ignorant dirty masses. Also he was a pretty big dork for someone who thought h was so super superior. Basically he just wanted a secret society but wasn't "elite enough" to get into Skull and Bones. He also mainly used it as a cover to get laid. Given his entire persona, it's not a mystery to me why he would have otherwise been a basement incel.
Just like there are plenty of nice Christians who haven't read the Bible deeply enough to understand what an evil tyrant biblegod is, I would assume most of the good CoS people haven't actually read or fully understood everything Lavey said and wrote. it's hard to imagine someone having read all of it and not understanding all the elitism, narcissism, and authoritarianism therein.
Given that, it would be foolish to assume the organization doesn't attract a lot of people who DO understand those facets of CoS and are fully on board with them. Being told you're a superior being just for being a member of CoS obviously is going to appeal to malignant narcissists and it shouldn't be shocking that people like that would be drawn to the organization.
that's clearly not a universal thing, though. The main CoS has a rabid hate on for TST. I'm not sweeping everybody into one pot. I'm saying there are a lot of CoS ppl who rabidly hate TST and their official twitter account seems incapable of not randomly arguing and attacking anyone who says anything nice about TST. They clearly have a bug up their ass. I'm not saying "everybody's bad". I'm saying there are bad actors in every organization and given the known weird one-sided rivalry (I don't ever see TST people attacking or even really thinking about CoS for the most part), I would at least consider the possibility that not everybody coming from there to TST has the purest motives.
I don't know or care to dive deeper into any more drama. The CoS members who I consider friends know my beliefs and how much I believe in TST and Mr Greaves and they respect that completely. I now look at LaVey as kind of a genius Satanic Grandpa who had colorful ideas but also happened to be a dirty old man who was a bit too silly for my taste. I do have to admit, LaVey has grown on me slightly.
The creative process requires chaos before form emerges ~ Marilyn Ferguson
…Perhaps this is where some type of form emerges.
We’re just glad you aren’t apologizing for being you! I think all those haters are just pissed their own expectations weren’t met. That’s what happens when you set expectations, though.
The very traits so many seem to think of as "character flaws" (the strident standing for one thing and not bending or breaking no matter how many people complain) is what makes me trust someone as a leader because I know where they stand, what they plan to do, and that nobody can worm their way into the organization and manipulate them onto a different unrelated path.
Exactly!